Posted by Mitchell Plitnick under
United States ,
Six Day War
buy cheap doxycycline online
cheapest synthroid prices
xanax without prescription
cheap prozac tablets
cheap tramadol
acomplia
zithromax pharmacy
tramadol without a prescription
phentermine pills
buy generic accutane
where to buy cialis
cheap zoloft online
doxycycline prices
cheap generic phentermine
nexium online cheap
cheap synthroid tablets
acomplia online
nexium pills
buy cheap propecia
buy plavix
buy diazepam without prescription
accutane online stores
accutane cheap
cheap generic viagra
clomid without prescription
cheap plavix
buy bactrim without prescription
tramadol online
phentermine without prescription
buy synthroid
diazepam online stores
discount diazepam
nexium online stores
bactrim online stores
order diazepam
purchase lasix online
purchase lorazepam
bactrim prescription
buy cheap tramadol
zithromax online
cheap acomplia
generic phentermine
plavix for sale
cheap plavix tablets
cheap tramadol tablets
pharmacy lasix
lasix sale
pharmacy diazepam
buy doxycycline
accutane prices
buy cheap phentermine
lasix prices
buy cheap nexium
synthroid for sale
plavix discount
buy doxycycline cheap
lowest price alprazolam
cheap lorazepam online
nexium cheap
cheap generic cialis
discount propecia
pharmacy prozac
soma discount
soma online
buy generic flagyl
discount nexium
cheapest tramadol prices
discount viagra
levitra generic
buy accutane cheap
synthroid pharmacy
where to buy phentermine
acomplia pills
viagra sale
bactrim pharmacy
buy accutane without prescription
lowest price acomplia
buy lorazepam cheap
buy phentermine without prescription
diazepam for sale
cheapest clomid
valium prices
buy prozac online
tramadol sale
clomid online
synthroid cheap
cheap alprazolam online
order soma online
buy zithromax
phentermine no prescription
where to buy lorazepam
accutane online
where to buy bactrim
propecia cheap
cheapest valium prices
pharmacy lorazepam
bactrim for sale
price of soma
buy cialis
order bactrim online
lorazepam without prescription
zoloft without prescription
lowest price diazepam
pharmacy clomid
cheap propecia
buy levitra cheap
purchase soma online
purchase prozac
order zithromax
valium no prescription
valium
prozac prices
nexium generic
zoloft cheap
cheap generic prozac
order doxycycline online
diazepam pills
levitra
accutane no prescription
buy lorazepam
tramadol prices
online doxycycline
where to buy synthroid
buy alprazolam online
alprazolam prescription
zoloft
buy cheap flagyl online
zithromax pills
online valium
acomplia cheap
plavix pills
cheap zithromax online
levitra online stores
lorazepam pills
order flagyl online
doxycycline prescription
cheap lorazepam
buy acomplia
discount acomplia
cheapest prozac prices
alprazolam without a prescription
online synthroid
cheap phentermine tablets
alprazolam
order clomid online
cheapest diazepam prices
zoloft for sale
viagra pharmacy
buy cheap lorazepam online
clomid online cheap
pharmacy tramadol
buy cheap soma
purchase clomid online
cheap doxycycline
purchase prozac online
purchase cialis
flagyl prescription
diazepam prices
viagra online stores
accutane
prozac pharmacy
bactrim generic
buy zoloft without prescription
lowest price flagyl
clomid pills
buy clomid online
cialis pharmacy
pharmacy phentermine
price of clomid
buy acomplia online
price of prozac
phentermine
online tramadol
buy lasix online
levitra without prescription
buy cheap xanax online
cheapest propecia prices
cheapest acomplia prices
buy lorazepam online
cheap generic xanax
accutane without a prescription
synthroid without prescription
order plavix
flagyl without a prescription
buy generic clomid
lowest price lorazepam
order soma
order zoloft online
propecia sale
synthroid discount
pharmacy cialis
price of lasix
prozac pills
tramadol without prescription
valium pharmacy
purchase zoloft online
buy cheap lorazepam
accutane for sale
lowest price clomid
levitra no prescription
synthroid sale
nexium prices
lowest price nexium
generic lorazepam
purchase synthroid
xanax online cheap
purchase bactrim
cheapest alprazolam
synthroid generic
cheap xanax
cheap generic acomplia
buy cheap lasix online
accutane pharmacy
alprazolam pills
cheap valium online
lowest price cialis
plavix generic
buy levitra online
tramadol online stores
buy cheap nexium online
zithromax
lorazepam online stores
acomplia no prescription
lorazepam cheap
bactrim no prescription
buy plavix online
lasix generic
purchase clomid
buy cheap zoloft online
buy generic xanax
doxycycline online cheap
lorazepam online cheap
cialis online cheap
zithromax for sale
generic lasix
cheapest synthroid
generic nexium
purchase phentermine online
prozac generic
order prozac online
clomid prices
where to buy tramadol
price of phentermine
phentermine prescription
lowest price propecia
cialis online stores
discount plavix
cheap diazepam
soma generic
cheapest viagra prices
cheapest bactrim prices
buy cheap flagyl
lorazepam pharmacy
buy diazepam online
propecia discount
buy valium
buy zithromax without prescription
buy generic tramadol
order levitra
valium discount
nexium online
discount doxycycline
bactrim cheap
propecia prices
plavix prices
online nexium
clomid generic
synthroid
buy cheap prozac online
lasix online stores
buy cheap valium online
cheap xanax tablets
xanax without a prescription
buy soma online
cheap phentermine online
where to buy prozac
where to buy alprazolam
buy cheap plavix online
order phentermine
generic clomid
buy tramadol cheap
prozac
cheap propecia tablets
generic xanax
purchase zithromax
levitra online
purchase viagra
propecia generic
generic synthroid
buy cheap alprazolam online
where to buy propecia
acomplia without prescription
cheapest diazepam
order lorazepam
xanax discount
where to buy zithromax
cheap diazepam tablets
price of cialis
cheap generic lasix
order flagyl
buy clomid without prescription
diazepam online cheap
order accutane
zithromax without prescription
doxycycline cheap
lasix online cheap
cheapest plavix
alprazolam online
buy cheap clomid online
buy generic zithromax
levitra for sale
buy cheap acomplia
doxycycline online stores
purchase flagyl online
nexium
generic plavix
pharmacy nexium
price of alprazolam
purchase nexium online
buy generic cialis
cheap flagyl tablets
buy cheap bactrim online
buy alprazolam cheap
soma sale
buy generic synthroid
phentermine sale
plavix pharmacy
buy viagra online
xanax
purchase cialis online
pharmacy flagyl
alprazolam no prescription
cheapest bactrim
buy cialis online
clomid sale
flagyl online stores
tramadol pills
propecia online cheap
lowest price tramadol
cheap valium tablets
price of viagra
clomid no prescription
synthroid pills
order doxycycline
nexium sale
order cialis
price of zithromax
buy nexium cheap
alprazolam for sale
discount valium
buy generic acomplia
generic tramadol
plavix without a prescription
online clomid
cheapest lorazepam prices
lasix without a prescription
order levitra online
cheap cialis online
online soma
cialis no prescription
buy propecia
zoloft discount
lowest price lasix
cheap prozac
phentermine generic
cheapest levitra
levitra pharmacy
clomid pharmacy
bactrim prices
acomplia online cheap
where to buy diazepam
cheap generic levitra
accutane sale
tramadol discount
cheapest doxycycline
purchase acomplia online
accutane online cheap
cheap generic tramadol
price of bactrim
order lorazepam online
order xanax online
purchase levitra
flagyl online
valium for sale
cialis
plavix sale
cheap levitra tablets
price of zoloft
purchase viagra online
cheap generic zoloft
flagyl discount
prozac prescription
soma pharmacy
propecia
order propecia online
price of flagyl
online levitra
price of doxycycline
bactrim
propecia without a prescription
acomplia prescription
order synthroid
zoloft online cheap
flagyl sale
buy synthroid cheap
buy lasix without prescription
zoloft without a prescription
alprazolam sale
buy tramadol without prescription
prozac without a prescription
flagyl generic
buy propecia online
cialis prices
purchase lasix
cheapest nexium
purchase diazepam
buy lorazepam without prescription
buy cialis cheap
lorazepam no prescription
where to buy accutane
xanax online
zithromax discount
prozac discount
synthroid prescription
lowest price bactrim
discount zithromax
accutane generic
buy generic bactrim
order valium online
buy generic lorazepam
cheap generic flagyl
where to buy zoloft
purchase accutane online
discount phentermine
plavix cheap
zithromax cheap
cheap generic lorazepam
viagra
cheap xanax online
purchase bactrim online
generic valium
propecia online stores
flagyl pharmacy
lowest price valium
buy synthroid without prescription
cheap viagra online
buy cheap lasix
cheap doxycycline tablets
levitra cheap
online alprazolam
diazepam pharmacy
cheapest nexium prices
purchase acomplia
xanax pharmacy
propecia pharmacy
cheap accutane online
valium without prescription
cheap alprazolam
purchase propecia
purchase diazepam online
cheapest phentermine prices
generic zoloft
order tramadol
clomid online stores
plavix no prescription
price of synthroid
cheap generic propecia
cheapest tramadol
order alprazolam online
buy alprazolam without prescription
buy cheap cialis
discount levitra
where to buy valium
cheap prozac online
cheap generic soma
lorazepam generic
buy flagyl cheap
price of propecia
lowest price soma
order acomplia online
lowest price viagra
buy doxycycline without prescription
cheap zithromax tablets
flagyl no prescription
diazepam without a prescription
cheap levitra online
prozac online cheap
levitra without a prescription
buy generic doxycycline
buy prozac cheap
phentermine for sale
buy bactrim cheap
pharmacy zithromax
cheapest flagyl
where to buy flagyl
acomplia online stores
buy lasix cheap
buy cheap propecia online
cheap soma
cheapest accutane prices
pharmacy alprazolam
lasix pharmacy
cheap zithromax
viagra prescription
zithromax without a prescription
online accutane
cheap lasix online
acomplia generic
cheap flagyl
cheap clomid tablets
order lasix online
cheapest alprazolam prices
buy nexium
buy cheap clomid
synthroid without a prescription
accutane pills
buy clomid
diazepam sale
bactrim sale
lorazepam
cheap doxycycline online
valium pills
buy soma cheap
buy lasix
phentermine online stores
buy synthroid online
online lorazepam
lasix no prescription
buy generic propecia
xanax for sale
cheapest zoloft prices
buy phentermine cheap
plavix online
cheap bactrim
cheap viagra tablets
viagra without prescription
cheap generic diazepam
buy zoloft cheap
order accutane online
cheapest soma prices
clomid cheap
viagra prices
phentermine cheap
nexium pharmacy
discount synthroid
lorazepam prices
buy xanax
flagyl cheap
cheap generic doxycycline
buy cheap levitra
prozac no prescription
buy zithromax cheap
discount lasix
discount tramadol
prozac without prescription
discount cialis
cheap lasix
soma prices
online phentermine
buy propecia without prescription
cheap diazepam online
online diazepam
plavix online cheap
order bactrim
where to buy soma
cheapest xanax prices
buy cheap xanax
xanax prices
cheap clomid online
prozac online
lowest price zithromax
online bactrim
cheapest cialis
valium online stores
synthroid online stores
zoloft prices
generic acomplia
xanax cheap
diazepam discount
viagra online
purchase tramadol online
valium without a prescription
order zithromax online
doxycycline no prescription
tramadol
clomid for sale
pharmacy soma
viagra discount
synthroid online cheap
purchase propecia online
viagra online cheap
cheap valium
cialis without a prescription
discount prozac
lasix online
levitra online cheap
cheap soma online
buy levitra without prescription
buy flagyl online
buy cheap zithromax online
acomplia discount
where to buy plavix
cheapest soma
soma online cheap
nexium without a prescription
purchase alprazolam
zoloft online
tramadol no prescription
cheap phentermine
online cialis
zoloft online stores
phentermine online
lasix pills
valium sale
cheap bactrim online
clomid prescription
generic viagra
levitra pills
purchase xanax online
buy bactrim
pharmacy plavix
buy cheap diazepam
accutane prescription
buy cheap diazepam online
buy nexium online
cheap lorazepam tablets
cheap alprazolam tablets
price of valium
buy cheap synthroid online
discount bactrim
lasix without prescription
generic alprazolam
flagyl without prescription
online xanax
viagra no prescription
generic zithromax
levitra prices
generic cialis
buy cheap phentermine online
buy clomid cheap
buy xanax cheap
cialis online
buy generic viagra
doxycycline discount
order clomid
online propecia
cheap plavix online
purchase valium online
cheap zoloft
generic propecia
lorazepam discount
buy cheap soma online
buy cheap prozac
phentermine prices
xanax pills
online prozac
prozac online stores
acomplia pharmacy
acomplia prices
buy viagra
lowest price doxycycline
cheap acomplia online
cheapest levitra prices
buy cheap doxycycline
buy cheap tramadol online
propecia prescription
zithromax generic
buy tramadol
price of plavix
lowest price phentermine
prozac sale
buy alprazolam
cheap generic clomid
cheapest accutane
discount soma
purchase synthroid online
buy generic plavix
doxycycline generic
purchase plavix
xanax prescription
valium generic
bactrim online cheap
purchase lorazepam online
buy xanax online
alprazolam online stores
price of acomplia
zoloft prescription
soma pills
generic levitra
cheap synthroid
discount zoloft
alprazolam pharmacy
viagra cheap
cheap accutane
cheap generic bactrim
buy phentermine online
buy flagyl
buy levitra
cheapest acomplia
buy generic phentermine
price of tramadol
buy cheap zithromax
cheap lasix tablets
buy plavix cheap
nexium discount
tramadol pharmacy
purchase accutane
phentermine online cheap
buy cheap acomplia online
cialis cheap
lasix for sale
cheap flagyl online
nexium no prescription
cheapest lasix prices
pharmacy xanax
buy tramadol online
alprazolam without prescription
buy zithromax online
order nexium
viagra generic
buy generic valium
where to buy acomplia
acomplia without a prescription
buy cheap viagra
pharmacy levitra
order phentermine online
buy flagyl without prescription
buy accutane
buy cheap alprazolam
purchase zithromax online
lowest price prozac
lowest price accutane
doxycycline sale
bactrim without a prescription
alprazolam online cheap
cheap generic zithromax
pharmacy bactrim
levitra discount
cheapest plavix prices
buy cheap synthroid
purchase doxycycline online
buy cialis without prescription
generic bactrim
buy zoloft online
synthroid prices
propecia online
cheap acomplia tablets
buy cheap zoloft
doxycycline pharmacy
cheapest prozac
cheap viagra
cheap nexium online
price of diazepam
cheap generic plavix
cialis prescription
xanax online stores
soma prescription
plavix without prescription
soma for sale
lowest price zoloft
cheapest zithromax prices
cheapest zithromax
buy generic alprazolam
lorazepam for sale
alprazolam generic
cialis for sale
cheap tramadol online
cheapest cialis prices
synthroid online
order tramadol online
buy viagra without prescription
order viagra online
zithromax no prescription
order plavix online
flagyl pills
cheap cialis tablets
cheap clomid
diazepam generic
buy generic nexium
purchase alprazolam online
flagyl
propecia pills
viagra without a prescription
propecia for sale
cheap cialis
flagyl for sale
prozac cheap
diazepam without prescription
zoloft sale
order viagra
accutane discount
doxycycline for sale
valium prescription
lorazepam online
bactrim discount
cheapest valium
order zoloft
alprazolam cheap
zoloft generic
buy prozac without prescription
purchase phentermine
online lasix
online flagyl
cheapest propecia
lorazepam sale
order synthroid online
valium online cheap
purchase doxycycline
cialis discount
lowest price plavix
purchase xanax
zithromax prices
pharmacy propecia
buy prozac
doxycycline
cheap generic synthroid
purchase tramadol
pharmacy viagra
cheapest xanax
soma
cheap generic accutane
soma no prescription
order lasix
price of nexium
buy valium without prescription
buy cheap accutane
xanax generic
doxycycline without a prescription
buy cheap levitra online
synthroid no prescription
cheapest phentermine
valium online
buy generic levitra
cheapest doxycycline prices
prozac for sale
plavix online stores
purchase levitra online
lorazepam without a prescription
zithromax online stores
lasix prescription
buy cheap cialis online
buy valium online
pharmacy zoloft
pharmacy doxycycline
price of accutane
cheapest clomid prices
clomid without a prescription
valium cheap
acomplia sale
bactrim without prescription
zoloft pharmacy
levitra prescription
tramadol cheap
buy viagra cheap
cheapest zoloft
buy soma
cheap propecia online
flagyl online cheap
cheap generic alprazolam
cheapest lorazepam
buy diazepam
purchase soma
soma without a prescription
buy generic diazepam
buy cheap viagra online
cheap levitra
cheap generic valium
purchase zoloft
order prozac
plavix
zoloft no prescription
discount xanax
pharmacy valium
clomid discount
cheap accutane tablets
accutane without prescription
soma without prescription
soma cheap
propecia no prescription
propecia without prescription
zithromax prescription
pharmacy accutane
cheapest viagra
buy bactrim online
diazepam cheap
order acomplia
buy generic zoloft
order valium
cheap soma tablets
xanax sale
buy generic soma
viagra for sale
cheap zoloft tablets
lorazepam prescription
diazepam prescription
price of xanax
nexium without prescription
order diazepam online
discount flagyl
where to buy lasix
pharmacy synthroid
cheap nexium tablets
buy cheap valium
generic prozac
buy xanax without prescription
zithromax sale
cheapest lasix
bactrim pills
lasix
where to buy xanax
diazepam online
order xanax
doxycycline pills
purchase nexium
phentermine pharmacy
cialis pills
buy doxycycline online
buy soma without prescription
lowest price levitra
clomid
alprazolam discount
buy phentermine
buy generic lasix
buy acomplia without prescription
cheap bactrim tablets
discount lorazepam
zithromax online cheap
buy diazepam cheap
generic soma
order propecia
generic diazepam
order nexium online
tramadol online cheap
purchase plavix online
lasix discount
online viagra
alprazolam prices
phentermine discount
where to buy levitra
acomplia for sale
soma online stores
buy cheap bactrim
bactrim online
price of levitra
generic accutane
buy cheap accutane online
order cialis online
nexium for sale
where to buy nexium
price of lorazepam
buy propecia cheap
doxycycline online
levitra sale
cheap nexium
cheapest flagyl prices
cialis without prescription
buy nexium without prescription
discount accutane
where to buy viagra
zoloft pills
where to buy doxycycline
tramadol for sale
buy zoloft
tramadol generic
cialis sale
where to buy clomid
online zoloft
cheap synthroid online
buy accutane online
nexium prescription
purchase flagyl
flagyl prices
buy generic prozac
discount alprazolam
diazepam no prescription
buy cheap plavix
viagra pills
phentermine without a prescription
buy valium cheap
generic flagyl
cialis generic
online zithromax
cheap generic nexium
doxycycline without prescription
lasix cheap
online plavix
buy plavix without prescription
generic doxycycline
plavix prescription
buy acomplia cheap
diazepam
xanax no prescription
discount clomid
purchase valium
online acomplia
lowest price xanax
tramadol prescription
pharmacy acomplia
lowest price synthroid
order alprazolamThis is the first time I’ve ever written publicly about the issue of the USS Liberty, the American espionage vessel that was attacked by Israeli forces during the Six-Day War.
I’ve never written about it before because there was scant substance to write about. The facts we have don’t extend much beyond this: Israeli planes attacked the Liberty, followed by a sea attack by an Israeli ship. The incident left 34 American sailors dead and 170 more injured, some severely. Two US squadrons were mobilized after the attack on the Liberty started and were then called back. Israel claimed the attack was a case of mistaken identity and apologized, and a US investigation was pursued, but only a quick one, which ended with American acceptance of Israel’s excuse and the matter was closed.
Today, we really don’t know much more than that. But the Chicago Tribune brought the incident back up this week, and so, despite the fact that the article really doesn’t shed any new light on the episode, I feel the urge to say something about this.
The attack on the Liberty has provided great fodder for conspiracy theorists for the past four decades. The surviving sailors who have spoken publicly have all been unanimous in rejecting the Israeli claim that they did not see the American flag flying on the ship. The one major point the Tribune article provides is much more conclusive evidence that indeed, the Israeli pilots were fully aware that they were attacking an American ship. This isn’t a big surprise, frankly; Israel’s explanation on this score was never all that credible. The Liberty was not off-course or in an unexpected place and there was no reason ever offered as to why the ship would not have been flying its colors.
But the conspiracy theorists have repeatedly used this incident to prove how much fealty the US gives to Israel, and frankly, that doesn’t make a lot of sense. The US commitment to Israel in 1967 was a lot more tenuous and more slender than it is today. There is no credible evidence that Israel would be able to get away with an intentional attack on an American ship in those days, even if one wants to argue that their influence is so great today that they could (a claim I would not agree with, as is obvious from my recent post on the Israel Lobby).
But the fact is, Israel’s explanation for the incident is not credible as it stands, and the lack of serious investigation by the United States is also inexplicable based on the evidence we have now. The question, in particular, of why two squadrons were scrambled in response and then recalled (likely on direct instructions from Washington, possibly from as high a source as Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara) is an open one, not explained by any facts we have at hand, other than the mere fact of the event.
The mystery around this issue invites the worst kind of anti-Israel venom. It is obvious to anyone who looks at this incident with even a modicum of critical thinking that a secret or secrets are being kept. The conspiracy theorists have, fortunately, not come up with any explanations that are any more credible than the official ones. Just as the official version of the story has gaping holes, no one has explained what could possibly be of such great importance to Israel that they would risk making an enemy of the US by attacking the Liberty. This was, after all, an obvious possibility if Israel did indeed know that the ship was American.
The ongoing shroud of mystery about the Liberty is a real danger to Israel. Despite the Tribune article, most Americans are unaware that Israel attacked and crippled an American ship forty years ago in an unprovoked attack. It goes without saying that if this incident becomes public with the information we have now, Israel’s standing in the eyes of the American public will take an enormous hit. Maybe it should, but we don’t have anything approaching the full story, and thus any backlash in any direction is not justified. It would, nonetheless, happen if the story was public.
The truth about the Liberty needs to come out. It is obvious form the behavior of the two squadrons of fighters from the US Sixth Fleet that someone somewhere in the American chain of command was as complicit in this as anyone in Israel. Moreover, Israel was at war and the way the Israeli military works, a great deal of power is in the hands of commanders of lesser stature especially during a war. It is entirely possible that whatever happened here was the result of decisions made well below the level of the Prime Minister, Defense Minister and even the most senior military officials. It’s equally possible that Israeli leaders up to and including Prime Minister Levi Eshkol were involved.
The point is we don’t know. Neither the official story nor any of the alternatives offered pass the laugh test. We should know what happened here. Should this story get more public traction, as it might, whether now or some day later, it will be explosive. The families of the sailors who were killed, those survivors who are living with the after-effects of this attack and the American and Israeli publics deserve more than they have gotten. The secrecy around the Liberty invites speculation of the rankest sort. Those involved are mostly dead or near the end of their lives. It is hard to imagine that the truth here will be as harmful as the cover-up has the potential to be.
October 6th, 2007 at 6:55 pm
There are two possible and one impossible explanations.
The impossible one has been regurgitated constantly for the past 40 years by Jew-haters of many sub-categories. Namely, that “for NO good reason, Israel deliberately attacked an allied vessel (The Liberty) at significant cost of life and limb of US servicemen.” To these people, since there is no definite explanation, the worst must be so. But it completely lacks sense.
The two POSSIBLE remaining explanations are:
1. It was a mistake. While this may sound far-fetched, “friendly fire” remains a major component to all sorts of warfare, even today with sophisticated electronic tagging devices. I know of a U.S. Marine who is in prison for life because one of his (trainee) subordinates landed a live artillery shell on the CO’s house, killing his wife. If one does the math, wrongful targeting occurs frequently, even in 2007. If the readers will please recall, during the Bosnian military action, the Chinese Embassy was mistakenly flattened.
2. The other possible explanation is that the USA was playing both sides of the street and jeopardizing an Israeli victory. This theory is explored in great depth on “The Secret War Against the Jews” by Loftis and Aarons. http://www.amazon.com/Secret-War-Against-Jews-Espionage/dp/0312156480/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/103-2621369-2977455?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1191713546&sr=8-1
The index lists no less then 26 pages which deal with this incident. It is hardly a secret that the US and England were courting favor with various Arab nations and former Nazi war criminals. It is also hardly denied that the USA and England favored a scenario whereby the Israelis would act Christ-like and accept some measure of defeat and death (like good Christians should.) The remaining questions are:
A) Did this two-faced desire rise to the level of the Liberty assisting certain Arab military, as Loftus and Aarons claim to have evidence suggesting?
B) Is this explanation more plausible then the accidental friendly fire story?
C) Would this also explain why the USA never made much of a fuss? As the purported truth would be more embarrassing then the consequences?
Explanation number one is ridiculous. That Israel would just be compelled to kill some Americans, for no reason, other then their thirst for innocent blood. I find it no coincidence that the rehashing of this incident has been publicized in the Chicago Tribune, home to Columnist Robert Novak and basically, the eternal home of the Nazi movement in America. These same people seem to have lost all venom for Germany, who nearly took over the entire world and was responsible for about 100,000,000 deaths in WW2. They have no animus for France, who orchestrated the Oil of Food Scandal. Israel teeter-totters on the precipous of destruction. Certain people can’t seem to get that point and won’t be happy until (may God kindly forbid) Israel looses a significant portion of its population.
October 6th, 2007 at 7:09 pm
Whatever the truth is, nothing is served by replacing one conspiracy theory with another one. The problem is that now there are two questions to be answered, what happened and also why the cover-up? The answer to the second may be more interesting than the first, but probably best to assume nothing at this point.
October 6th, 2007 at 9:09 pm
John:
“Whatever the truth is . . . ”
Its not “whatever”.
There are a finite number of logical possibilities.
Either:
Accident (story should end)
Intentional and without cause (makes no sense)
Intentional with reasonable cause (story ended to bury the reasonable cause.)
You got a 4th explanation?
October 6th, 2007 at 9:58 pm
2. The other possible explanation is that the USA was playing both sides of the street and jeopardizing an Israeli victory.
THE other??? It sounded like you were saying it was either a mistake or a response to an anti-Israeli conspiracy.
I agree it was either an accident or intentional, although it could also be both. In the heat of battle chaos reigns supreme (”the fog of war” it is called). Stuff happens and sometimes nobody really knows for sure. Gulf of Tonkin Incident was like that, I’m told (by someone on the Maddox). Maybe something was intended (unknown) and also something happened accidentally or got out of control. I doubt it was purely accidental, but beyond that there are a number of possibilities. Could be there was intent to intimidate, for example, which somehow went awry. Needs to finally be investigated if still possible. Meanwhile, keep an open mind.
October 7th, 2007 at 12:02 am
“THE other??? It sounded like you were saying it was either a mistake or a response to an anti-Israeli conspiracy.”
That is exactly what I am saying.
You and your ”fog of war”. This is now the second time you have used that concept to submit the otherwise implausible is really the most likely.
How could it be both accidental and deliberate?
What type of “fog” overwhelms the basic building-blocks of human reasoning?
Slightly pregnant?
Multiple versions of conflicted reality all being true?
You ‘lefties’ must be so-named because you “left” your common-sense at the door when you came in.
I know this is a strong response to your otherwise un-combative postings but I am striving to unravel misteries not yet solved, while you are trying to unravel those already quantified.
October 7th, 2007 at 6:06 am
I am striving to unravel misteries not yet solved, while you are trying to unravel those already quantified
Just the opposite, if I understand you correctly. You are saying there are only two possibilities, one of which most people think is wrong. If you are right, then what mystery is there? I am saying it is not as cut-and-dried as you assert. There are other possibilities, one of which is that it was both intentional and accidental. This is not a leftist position, btw, nor one that assaults the “building blocks of human reasoning.” It merely suggests maybe there are some things Isidor has not thought of. [gasp]
As to your dismissal of “the fog of war,” if you think everything always goes like clockwork and according to plan in combat, you’d better check with someone who has been there. The reality is that when all hell is breaking loose, communications can be imperfect at best and people get confused. Actions can be interpreted as provocative or hostile sometimes when they are not. You’ve also never heard of “friendly fire”? That’s something that occurs regularly due to confused communications in combat, the fog of war. Things happen, and they can be partly intentional and partly accidental. Humans screw up on a regular basis.
“Military intelligence” is an oxymoron a Groucho Marx pointed out. The hotline to Moscow was put in the Oval Office after the Cuban Missle Crisis because of the realization that confused communications could lead to mutual catastrophe through one side misreading the intentions of the other side.
October 7th, 2007 at 8:31 am
“the fog of war. Things happen, and they can be partly intentional and partly accidental.”
Not really. An attack on a ‘friendly’ is not both. The 100% intent was to attack an enemy, not a friend. This would not be ‘accidental’ in the sense of say, for example, accidentally stepping into an open elevator shaft. But for the example being discussed, the only important issue in the INTENT. In that sense, there can be no ambiguity and suggestions to the contrary only feed the mongers of hate against Israel and Jews.
“You are saying there are only two possibilities, one of which most people think is wrong.”
I am saying that only three possibilities exist of which one is HIGHLY unlikely because the only way it makes any sense is if the Hebrews deliberately targeted friendly USA forces for no other reason then why they {Jews} poison gentile wells, drink gentile’s baby blood and crucified Jesus. Namely, they remain eternal enemies of God and mankind.
The other two possibilities are:
Accident -or
The “Liberty” became a necessary military target in order to win that war, for reasons suggested above (by Loftus and Aarons).
I don’t really care which is the truth. I only care to stop the people who keep throwing this incident up in my face (40 years later) to try and prove the first suggestion.
“It merely suggests maybe there are some things Isidor has not thought of. [gasp]”
I am sure there are many such things [double gasp]. You have merely failed to identify one.
If you would really like a good gasp, write the following down, which I suspect will be published in the next few years:
Gravity is the result of the slight negative mass of space.
Science yet assumes that “space” is the mere lack of any measurable “mass”. This is Einstein’s most significant blunder. Space contains a slight negative bias, which produces “surface tension” and what we know as “gravity”. This is due to the fact that Space is actually a very diluted (expanded and weakened) form of “anti-matter”. This also explains why science tabulates a huge amount of missing “anti-matter” in the universe. Its not missing. Its just been stretched to the stage where it does not kill the opposing matter on contact. This point may be “discovered” by the super-particle-collider in Switzerland, if that device does not punch a hole in the fabric of the universe. Now, would such an event be “deliberate” or “accidental”?
October 7th, 2007 at 11:06 am
Particularly in naval engagements, there are maneuvers that are intended to intimidate or threaten. The position and speed of a vessel may itself be interpreted as hostile even if not intended as such. Fighter aircraft very often play chicken with each other and with ships. Very easy to intimidate when you are flying at Mach 1 straight at someone and coming within 300 yards before turning. I don’t know what happened. It is possible that someone in the Israeli command was not happy about the location / bearing / speed of the American ship or took it to be provocative. It could be that actions were taken in the air with the intent to intimidate (not to attack). And it is possible also that at point one or more screw-ups took place, in which case there was both intent and accident involved. An investigation would have to show what the rules of engagement were at the time, who violated them, why, and how.
I said this basically in post #4.
I personally do not believe that Israel intended to attack the USS Liberty deliberately for any reason, whether provoked or unprovoked. I suspect they intended to intimidate it into changing course and that somehow somebody lower in the chain of command screwed up. I don’t know. Needs to be investigated.
October 7th, 2007 at 11:10 am
there are maneuvers that are intended to intimidate or threaten.
As for example the proverbial “shot across the bow.”
So what happens if the deck gunner screws up and puts one right into the bridge instead? Then both ships commence firing on each other at close range and all hell breaks loose. Think this has never happened?
October 7th, 2007 at 6:47 pm
Having looked at the transcripts (as reported), it is clear that the Israeli pilots were sent to sink the ship but did not know till they got there that it was American. They seem to have been surprised to see an American flag flying. In light of that, I would speculate that someone on the ground had misidentified the ship on radar based on faulty intelligence, perhaps believing it was Egyptian and remaining convinced of that even after the pilots reported the American flag. Hence the go-ahead order when the pilot checked to see if he should proceed. “Military intelligence” is an oxymoron. Now go find the moron.